Walt Starr is a problem Poster. Admin, pls check

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CroneWit

04 Jul, 2013 03:27 PM

Walt Starr is a problem poster in NSA-related diaries (and is using his same tactics in Jesselyn Radack's diaries). Here is ONE example from ONE diary (the one I'm trying to read right now), and as you can see if you read the thread, he's a problem for others beside me.

The particular diary I'm reading now is: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/07/03/1221105/-If-Snowden-disappeared-the-CIA-would-be-blamed

Part of the dialogue about WS is here (and following comments): http://www.dailykos.com/comments/1221105/50640606#c25

  1. 1 Posted by Don midwest on 08 Jul, 2013 06:38 PM

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    WS has posted a hundred, if not hundreds of comments about NSA that hijack threads

    He is "NR" but still here

    Why?

  2. 2 Posted by Lady Libertine on 08 Jul, 2013 07:06 PM

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    we've seen these tactics before in past issues-campaigns, resulting in all kinds of chaos including bannings and even New site Rules (DBAD) ... (which are not consistently enforced).

    These tactics are especially annoying b/c they generally succeed in hijacking and globbing up the comment section of the diaries. These posters' apparent purpose is to glom up discussion and derail genuine substantive debate. walt starr is not the only one, theres a few of them who do this in every NSA-Snowden diary, but the more active (rec listed) diaries seem to be especially vulnerable.

    I will add that we are not issuing HR's for simple disagreement here and I for one have held off on HR'ing much at all for a while until now. There are a number of folks who do debate from the opposing position but they come with solid and sincere discussion, even if sometimes snarky or pissy, they are always welcome as long as they bring actual substance and are not there solely to disrupt.

    *Admin needs to address this in some kind of way.*

    Community Moderation alone is insufficient to manage these swarms. The Diarist can invoke DBAD and request a disruptor to cease and leave the diary but thats about it.

    Thank you.

  3. 3 Posted by poligirl on 08 Jul, 2013 08:21 PM

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    Christin is another one doing the same thing.

    in several different diaries. she's just lobbing insults and accusations and is generally just trying to start shit. it's disrupting and, i admit, angering to have to scroll through insults to get to substance. i'm guilty of replying to her a few times this weekend and i am trying not to feed her today, but i've already failed a couple times there. sigh.

    i mean, it would be one thing if it was an occasional couple of comments thrown in amongst contributing to the actual discussion/debate, but none of her comments (i'm hard pressed to think of even one) are made of any substance related to the diary topic. it's all personal with her comments.

    i emailed the comm mods this weekend but she clearly hasn't gotten any message as she was still doing it repeatedly today.

  4. 4 Posted by second gen on 08 Jul, 2013 08:27 PM

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    There are posters here at Daily Kos that I don't agree with. Please ban them all so that this place can be comfortable and cozy for me. I would appreciate it.

  5. 5 Posted by poligirl on 08 Jul, 2013 08:50 PM

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    yeah second gen, cuz that's what this is. not.

  6. 6 Posted by Lady Libertine on 08 Jul, 2013 08:57 PM

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    2ndgen, please see my comment above. I am totally open to lively debate in diaries & comments, and no one has called for everyone who disagrees with us to be banned. In fact, I see no calls for banishment, period. please do not abuse this help desk thread for bullshit hyperbole and snark, theres plenty of active diaries you can go to for that.

    P.S. to anyone, Can we keep this thread on topic please?

  7. 7 Posted by second gen on 08 Jul, 2013 09:03 PM

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    Well, we now have 2 names of that are being floated as "problems" how does this not look like a helpdesk thread about punishing/banning/whatever those you don't like "bothering" you.

    Also, the continued demands of only allowing comments you agree with is being done in diaries, and now helpdesk threads. I think it's important that anyone reading this thread realize that it's more a matter of opinion that Walt Starr needs banning when a good portion of his HRs are over disagreement and are only given by a handful of Kossacks.

  8. 8 Posted by Lady Libertine on 08 Jul, 2013 09:28 PM

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    "...only allowing comments you agree with..."
    no one is doing that.

    "... a matter of opinion that Walt Starr needs banning..."
    no one is doing that either, that I have seen.

    Again, my HR's on WS are NOT for disagreement.

  9. 9 Posted by joanneleon (unv... on 08 Jul, 2013 11:13 PM

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    I'd like to second CroneWit's complaint here. I've seen this hijacking by walt starr numerous times now over the past several weeks. Others had it handled so I haven't thrown any HRs but this time it's my diary that he wrecked and if I could, I would have HR'd him too.

    He came into the diary 4 minutes after I published it. There is no way he could have read the diary. The video interview (which I spent nearly an hour transcribing) is a 7 minute interview. The other interview is long, split into two separate articles on der Spiegel. So there's no way he read the diary. He simply rushed in there as soon as he saw it was a Snowden diary and hijacked the thread, making sure that he posted the first comment. Then, a large number of people uprated his comments as other members of the community were trying to moderate. They also have seen his history of hijacking diaries on this subject. The upraters should be sanctioned too, for encouraging the derailing of a diary that did not even express an opinion, was straight reporting, and they turned it into a bloody mess. Look at this comment thread in this diary. You have to scroll many many times to even get to any comment with substance or on topic discussion.
    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/07/08/1222038/-New-Snowden-video-interview

    Is somebody going to address this or what? People have been trying to draw attention to it for a long time now.

  10. 10 Posted by second gen on 08 Jul, 2013 11:16 PM

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    You had no video or transcription at the time that Walt Starr responded to your diary. I saw it almost immediately as well. The diary was expanded as time went on. He didn't have as much to comment on as is there now.

  11. 11 Posted by joanneleon (unv... on 08 Jul, 2013 11:49 PM

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    second gen, there was no embedded video but there was a f'ing link to the video which was the whole point of the diary. You had to click the link to see the video. If you didn't do that, which wallt starr clearly did not (physically impossible that he watched that video) then there is no way that he knew anything about that diary except the title of the guardian article which was in the diary with a link.

    The transcript was posted in the diary as I did it, which is indicated in the text of the diary and the updates. If I wanted to hide that I would not have documented the updates or used the strikethroughs to show the original text. It's clear that I planned to add it, and I did add it, in pieces as I completed it. None of that changes my argument at all. I made the point about the transcript to say that I put a lot of time and effort into the diary. It was not at all provocative, expressed no opinion on the subject, just organized and offered the information to the community and added the value of the transcript which I did myself. It didn't deserve being hijacked by walt starr and his friends encouraging it, like you did. You should be sanctioned for it too, IMHO. The community has been working together to try to address the problems that starr has been causing for weeks. You are undermining community noderation, deliberately.

    But the point is, which you deliberately ignored, that he rushed in to comment just 4 minutes after I published without even taking the time to look at the content that the diary offered. He did it just as he has done in many other diaries, which many other dkos users will attest to. He hijacked the diary, and the evidence is there no matter how much you try to deny it and you are just encouraging that. Congratulations for encouraging people to troll other people's diaries. Don't comment to me again. I'm so sick of these disingenuous arguments. It's all there in black and white and the timestamps and video lengths are there too.

  12. 12 Posted by Agathena (unver... on 09 Jul, 2013 01:52 AM

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    I see the same names coming up over and over. Posters with no intention of discussing issues but with every intention of causing trouble. They discuss HR's endlessly. They prevent interesting commentary and discussion. And they get away with it. Where's the moderation? and why doesn't staff tell them that they do not run the site?

  13. 13 Posted by duhban on 09 Jul, 2013 04:01 AM

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    funny I see the exact opposite. Way too many people have been allowed to label those that dissent as 'trolls', 'shills', 'zombies' and whatever else and then the same couple of commenters gang up and abuse their trusted user status.

    You all want to know an easy way to stop the 'disruptive posts'? How about you just ignore them?

  14. 14 Posted by joanneleon (unv... on 09 Jul, 2013 06:20 AM

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    For the record, duhban (above) was one of the people trolling in the same diary. 12 hours and 60 comments worth of bickering and baiting. Let the record show that this is not unusual in my diaries and pretty typical for him but he really outdid himself this time. Apparently 60 comments wasn't enough so he's added some more since I last estimated the number and now that's not enough, he's showing up in the help desk thread too! How lucky of us.

  15. 15 Posted by Otteray Scribe on 09 Jul, 2013 03:04 PM

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    CroneWit,
    When you start a discussion regarding community moderation, there is a choice in the drop-down menu when you start that identifies the subject as a moderation issue, and which automatically makes the discussion private. It is not too late to click it over to "private" and I suggest you do so.
    Thanks.

  16. 16 Posted by duhban on 09 Jul, 2013 05:00 PM

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    Well of we are going to talk about 'for the reccord'

    For the record:

    Yes I did post a number of comments in a diary that as of right now is at 871 comments and yes the total time difference was about 12 hours. Joanneleon's implication that all I did was sit in that diary though is misleading and false.

    In point of fact that diary is actually a great example of what I am talking about given that a number of my comments would never have happened except that a number of people suddenly had reading comprehension issues and tried to claim I was calling a kossack an idiot when it was plain as day I was calling Snowden an idiot.

    Oh let the record show that it 's been at least weeks if not longer since I commented in any of Joanneleon's diaries too, I am not sure what Joanneleon's definition of 'not unusual' but it's not how I use the words.

    And really if we are going to use this thread to complain about people could something be done to stop DeadHead from following me around? This is really starting to approach stalking the way he shows up in the middle of just about every comment with something passive aggressive to bait me. For that matter Clive all hat no horse Rodeo should really also stop following me around posting random pictures. I expect that behavior on 4chan not here.

  17. 17 Posted by GoGoGoEverton on 09 Jul, 2013 06:41 PM

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    The lack of self-awareness is truly amazing. There are SO many examples. for instance Fyc1ock or whatever in another thread, of DIRECTLY calling people morons and fools, and catching 16 uprates, including some from people in this thread like Agathena. If the admins come down evenhandedly, don't you think it won't be just Walt Starr with issues?

  18. 18 Posted by CenPhx on 09 Jul, 2013 07:18 PM

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    I just wanted to explain why I remove my comment from this help request -- the request has just turned into another pie fight.

  19. 19 Posted by Agathena on 09 Jul, 2013 07:37 PM

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    Yes you are right CenPhx, GoGoGoEverton who once followed my comments from diary to diary until I asked him to stop is now trying to engage me in a pie fight here.

  20. 20 Posted by GoGoGoEverton on 09 Jul, 2013 07:55 PM

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    I'll offend. You're a moron. (16+ / 2-) Recommended by:
    Agathena, OutcastsAndCastoffs, Stormin, Mikey, on the cusp, El Zmuenga, koNko, Preston S, corvo, Pale Jenova, phillies, bobdevo, stevemb, OldDragon, Jazzenterprises, pgm 01
    Hidden by:
    GoGoGoEverton, sviscusi

  21. 21 Posted by raptavio on 10 Jul, 2013 01:24 AM

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    This is definitely a thread that should have been private. Thanks to DeadHead for letting me know it was here...

    I suspect the mods won't do much; they know a pie fight when they see it, and probably will not intervene.

  22. 22 Posted by DeadHead on 10 Jul, 2013 10:43 AM

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    Now that my name has been brought up, this will be my one and only reply in this thread:

    duhban has made an accusation of "following him around" that is easily verified as false. A number of long-time members here have also noticed his behavior, and his comment history speaks for itself. His presence is in diaries written on a subject I feel strongly about -- the NSA/surveillance issue -- is impossible to avoid.

    I stand by my diaries and comments here, and welcome further scrutiny if necessary.

    If site administration has any questions or requires further information, please kosmail, or if you prefer, you may email me using the address on file.

    Thank you, and I apologize on behalf of my fellow Kossacks above for this unnecessary drama.

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